Episode 6: Rooted in Service - The Story of Our Volunteers Podcast Transcript

On any given day in our parks, something meaningful is unfolding. For instance, at Pella Crossing, a couple strolls around the ponds with their dog. Red-winged blackbirds sing from the cattails. A breeze stirs the cottonwood trees. A great blue heron stalks silently in the shallows.

Up at Heil Valley Ranch, mountain bikers wind through flower-dotted trails. Deer, startled, lift their heads as they pass, then return to grazing. And overhead, ravens call and circle the pines.

At Walker Ranch, native plants thrive on the hillsides. Noxious species have been wiped from the landscape, resulting in a more fire-resistant ecosystem.

On a crisp morning, a school bus pulls up at the Agricultural Heritage Center. Chattering students pour out, eager to explore and learn. And over at the Carolyn Holmberg Preserve, a giant map of Boulder County is stretched across the grass. Visitors step onto it, pointing out where they're from, where they've spotted wildlife, and learning about the diverse ecozones that shape our landscape.

Back at the Ron Stewart Parks and Open Space Building, staff are hard at work, planning public programs, coordinating conservation efforts, and supporting the smooth operation of more than 100,000 acres of land in our care.

And behind so much of what we do are our volunteers. Volunteers have been at the heart of Boulder County Parks and Open Space since the very beginning in 1975, when the first 10 volunteer naturalists began sharing their passion for nature and environmental education. Today, hundreds of volunteers work in every corner of the department, from pulling noxious weeds and rebuilding trails to monitoring wildlife, leading history tours, and welcoming visitors at trailheads. These everyday moments, the peaceful, the playful, the purposeful, are possible because of volunteers.

My name is Sarah Quiroga, a member of the Boulder County Parks and Open Space Education and Outreach Team, and I'm your host for this episode. Today we're talking with Pascal Freed, who dedicated 31 years to Boulder County Parks and Open Space. As supervisor of the Education and Outreach Team, Pascal supported and celebrated volunteers, helping to shape a culture of stewardship and community connection that continues to this day.

Welcome, Pascal. It's so good to talk with you. Thank you. Now, from what I understand, Education and Outreach, when you started, only had one full-time employee and you shared three seasonal with the rest of resource management. Is that true?

One and a half. I was a supervisor of a half-time person. Okay, okay. So I assume then you had to rely on volunteers quite a bit.

Yeah, definitely. Can you tell me a little bit about our first volunteer programs at Boulder County Parks and Open Space?

As you mentioned, there were two groups, and one of them was an advisory position called POSAC. Really, most municipalities have a citizen advisory committees. They were in place even before the department started, and then they became an official committee after that. And they did a lot of listening sessions with the community and trying to figure out what people wanted to preserve and what they thought open space would be, which was a really early concept back then, in 75. But the naturalists were really the first working for the department because the advisory committees worked for the commissioners. They liaison between the department and the commissioners, but really ultimately they're providing advice, recommendations to the commissioners. So the naturalists were the very first.

I believe POSAC is the Parks and Open Space Advisory Committee. That's still an active group today.

Yes, yes. And it started, I'm not sure how many they had in 75, but it got as big as 15 people, and then it came back down to, I think, probably a more manageable size.

So tell me, what were some of the first volunteer programs when Boulder County Parks and Open Space started?

And that was before my time. Right, of course, of course. I haven't been around that long. But initially, as you said, volunteer naturalists. I was told by Rich Koopman, who once worked here, and he wasn't even here at that time, but he knew the volunteers. It was an idea, I think, really sprouted by volunteers who said, I want to be a naturalist for the open space program, even though there wasn't much of a program. And they got 10 or 12 people who were knowledgeable. They were birders, they were educators, they loved plants, and they led hikes on the three properties or parcels of land that the county owned at that time, or at least was leasing and owning. And they would do nature hikes. I don't believe there was any training. I think they just were people who wanted to do it, they probably got a T-shirt or a hat, and they started leading public programs initially. And then the requested programs from school teachers and other groups came later. So really that passion for environmental education just really was the foundational part of that program.

Yeah. And again, the way that I understand it is that it was the volunteers who said, we want to volunteer for you. And instead of the director who probably had a lot on her hands that first year, we need a volunteer naturalist program. It was really started by a group who just saw the beauty of where they were living and wanted to share that. And I'm sure that the city of Boulder already had a program like that. So it was mimicking what they saw was working well in Boulder.

From that little kernel of 10 people, 12 people, whatever it was, how has then this evolved? And I came in in around 1992. In the 80s, after the county purchased Walker Ranch, there was a homestead there. And that was part of the purchase, desire for the purchase, wasn't just the foothills landscape, but also there was a historical ranch. And at that point, staff really felt that, you know, we can tell a story here. The history of ranching in Boulder County. And that was very different from any other open space program that I know of. Because usually history and open space or nature, you know, at that time especially, were very separate. There were museums or historical societies. But this was an open space program who wanted to dabble in history because they had a site.

And staff, but eventually volunteers, started putting on special events up at the homestead. Dedicated to the 1980s, what was going on at the time, and ranching in particular.

1880s or 1980s? 1880s. Did I say 1980?I think you did.Oh my gosh.No, 1880s.Even though 1980 was a long time ago.It's a long time ago at this point. No, 1880s.

And teachers either attended or heard about it, and they requested programs. So that's how that grew. And that really was the third official volunteer program was our cultural history, very much dedicated towards Walker Ranch programming, special events, school groups, and probably tours for the public occasionally.

From there, things started to rapidly get going. In my time in the early 1990s, there were Cub Scouts, Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts who wanted to get a service badge of something. And they would contact us and say, can we do some work for you? What can we do? And that became really the start of one-day projects or one-time projects, episodic projects compared to a volunteer who volunteers for a year length or whatever that may be. Really, those scouts and probably school groups, it was an occasional here and there, and they probably knew somebody on staff, a next-door neighbor, an uncle, and they did this.

And we formalized it really after we saw a need. The department did in the mid-1990s. Just like we can take advantage of the interest and maybe get some work done that staff is unable to do. And it was more formalized that people could call in and really, I would say negotiate, but not really, what's the menu of choices and what can you do?

At that point, we had a discussion, very small staff still, who's going to be in charge of that? We decided we needed a new position. It really came up that the people in operations, which is now recreation facilities, were not at their desk enough to return those phone calls. There weren't computers then. Or if they were, there was one in the building. People would call and it would take time to get back. And it was like, let's get a dedicated person that can interface with those interested groups, businesses, scouts, whatever, and start utilizing the interest of local residents in helping us get some work done.

It almost was an organic process of people wanting to help and then figuring out, oh, we need to somehow create a system for them to be able to help us with what we need rather than what they would like to do.

Yeah, yeah. And to do it not only in a timely manner, but to really start developing what is the need for the next year or the three years or the five-year plan? Where can we utilize volunteers? And I think that various staff who thought, well, we could use volunteers for this. Because the only other work group, we had full-time staff, very few seasonals, and there were jail crews. And jail crews aren't always the best for whatever the work is. We needed more people or different types, et cetera. But there was a demand by the public to, you know, can we help? And it was like, we can do this. But it had to be organized. It had to be really thought out. And how's this going to benefit the department and the staff helping, you know, to have their input?

So there was one person. Megan Davis was the first to have that position who came on board and really just went from work group to work group to work group like, how can volunteers help you? What can we do for a small group or a big group? What land management are you doing that volunteers could help you, and that began the episodic projects, and it grew. That portion of the department just, after you have a staff dedicated to it, it's just incredible, you know, the momentum of doing that because word got out that people could do that.

Well, and I like that word momentum because I would think that as more people participate in those programs and they tell their friends and then their friends want to get involved as well. Right, most of us, I assume you too, you know, we love Boulder County, Colorado, because of the outdoors. So to participate in activities out there, for a lot of people, that's pretty cool. Not everybody wants to do it, but for a lot of people it just sounds fun, and for the most part it is. It might be a little tiring, but it's fun. And those work projects were everything you'd imagine.

What are some of those work projects? I mean, I know we were just talking earlier that you went and were working out in the seed garden this morning.

Yeah, the native seed garden. At that point, it was a lot of trail work, maintenance, or perhaps construction. If we could go forward a little more, early 2000s, Ron Stewart became the director. When he came on board, he saw the value in volunteers, residents of Boulder County participating, and really, I think, challenged work groups that, you know, everybody should be able to work with volunteers.

So I could go through the list, you know, real quick, and the agricultural group:

•	Ditch cleaning, really pulling weeds off fence lines.

•	Collecting leftover vegetables that a farmer had cleared, but there was some left that could be utilized by community food chair.

•	A lot of trail maintenance, a lot of trail construction, for sure.

•	The grounds crew were down fencing, they built fencing, a lot of trash pickups, especially new properties.

There was a momentum in the 90s after the tax passed. We were acquiring property, and a lot of those properties had been owned, and there was, you know, just stuff left over. So we did a lot of cleanup, and they did a lot of cleanup, and recruited volunteers to help. And we had one group really got into it, like that's all they wanted to do was clean up open space, and tires, and parts of cars, and just, you know, old wood, and taking down fencing.

Historic preservation, they really utilized volunteers in painting or restoring some buildings. There's some things that they could do. And then when you move over to resource management, definitely education outreach, that's where it started. The naturalist program that you mentioned, being out in the parks, it started as a park host program, and now it's called Volunteer Ranger Corps, where they would hike, bike, or ride their horse, and that expanded to being at trailheads, talking to people, welcoming them. They attend special events, and they staff those trailhead displays, which is a wonderful educational tool, because people are getting ready for their hike, and some people come to parks, and they don't know where they are, what they're going to do, and they get that orientation.

Plant ecology really just took off. They had so much that could be done. The more the merrier. Initially, we're working with VOC, the Volunteers of Colorado for Colorado, I can't remember, and then WRV, Wildlife Restoration Volunteers, where they would partner, but then they started having their own group and their own projects of planting shrubs, trees, wetlands, removing things, building things, and then finally wildlife, which episodic was minimal. It was a lot of prairie dog fencing initially. It was putting up when we had really a lot of issues around prairie dogs, some of the ag lands that we purchased, but then it was wrapping trees with the cages to hold back the beavers, pulling out cattails so frogs could really have the habitat that they needed. So there was a lot going on. It was really just amazing how diverse and wide the work was.

That is amazing. That is wonderful to hear all those projects. You, I'm sure, in the Education Outreach Department, I'm sure you worked with many, many volunteers. Do you have a particular story or memory of something that made a significant impact?

The one that comes up often when thinking about groups of volunteers. After the 2013 flood, this area was just devastated. Roads were broken. Open space had so much junk that had been flowed, a lot of debris onto it, and we had closed a lot of parks because of that. Carolyn Holmberg, Anne U White, Pella Crossing, which was a favorite for people in the northern part of the county. We started doing just debris cleanup, and I remember really well being out at the Alexander Dawson property, which is not really a park, but it was owned by the county. The South Boulder Creek, it was just junk everywhere, and we were cleaning it, and people were so happy to do that. They just felt like this is what open space needed, and it was terrible being out there with a group of people picking up trash. It must have given them a tangible way to come back from a natural disaster like that.

Absolutely,because even if your home wasn't really affected by that flood, your drive to see Mom was affected by it, or your friend, etc. So it just felt good to get that crud off the fence line. So when you drove by, it sort of looked nice again instead of just this. was devastating for some. It was really incredible. And the group, they didn't know each other. It was just a public project. And they just really felt great about it, but they felt great about it together. I mean, it was really such an interesting experience, but just impactful.

You know, I can't not think of Ann Cooper, who's been a volunteer for us. She started in the 80s, so she's been around for 40-ish plus years. It's just amazing. You know, she started as a volunteer naturalist. She's a writer. She's an artist, and she's just kept up. She's done training for us, and really, you know, this department's been part of her life and vice versa. She's been such a resource, I think, for the department. During the pandemic, she didn't really know what she could do, so she started writing articles for images, department's quarterly magazine. It was fun to see, and you would think she was a brand new volunteer, and she wasn't. She was 35 years in. And she just really had such a connection with the department and so many volunteers and a lot, a lot of staff.

Well, and that speaks to the program in that someone who stays in the area or lives in the area wants to continue to volunteer over the course of 35 or 40 years and keeps finding new ways to be inspired and invigorated in what y'all are doing. Yeah. No, it's really. And she's not the only one. We've had volunteers, you know, 20 years. Catherine Young was the author for the Nature Detective Insert in Images for 20 years, you know, four times a year. And for about, I think, 10 of those years, she was living in Seattle. And just really, she got something out of it. I mean, all that research she did and the creative writing to make this palatable and understandable to young children, that partnership just with an individual to an organization, just really wonderful to see as a volunteer coordinator. You know, that's what you want every experience to be, but not everybody has 20 years to give.

Over the course of 35 or 40 years, have there been multi-generational volunteer families where maybe the children start volunteering with the parents? It started with Walker Ranch because really the ranch came alive with kids, you know, running around, playing hide-and-go-seek, jumping in the hay. One of them had a set of matches that was not good. But, you know, just having fun in their costumes. And we required parents to, or an adult, but usually it was a parent, to be with the kids. So that's where that started. But we had families where maybe mom or dad didn't really want to, and they liked it, and they stayed. And then the next child that grew up and was eight years old would help, definitely. And then vice versa. We definitely in the, I can't remember what they called it, but it was within plant ecology, collecting the native seed and then cleaning it. There was a mother-daughter duo. And I would say there's been many families working together or as one was leaving, the other became interested. And definitely a lot of partners. One person would be a volunteer, and finally the partner would go and say, I think that sounds really fun. Can I join too? So I think there have been those experiences for sure, and bringing on friends. But the Walker Ranch and probably at the Ag Center too, I imagine. But Walker Ranch especially because we needed children to make the ranch feel like it was in 1880.

How did we get schools to start coming to become, I understand you said there were scout groups or teachers would hear about us, and then would those volunteers be able to tie in with the school groups? We did marketing. We definitely went into the schools, or maybe not into the schools, but the principal's offices, and then eventually emails, and offered our services to lead a hike or to come into the school and do a program or to offer them a stewardship project. And that's something that really took off with Deborah Price. They would study something. And the first one was a camera, a wildlife camera that was set off South Boulder Creek, very close to Pella. And the kids put the camera out with Michelle Durant, who's a wildlife biologist. And we just wanted to know what wildlife was really in that area. And the kids would download the material and they would look, and I think they were fifth grade. And they did that for months and months and months and were able to document what they were seeing. They had to look it up and figure out what it was sometimes because it was just there behind, and then did a presentation to staff. So we've had that really big range of program participation to actually doing some work for us.

Oh, that's wonderful. That's just wonderful. And you're creating a spirit of volunteership in those kids that then they can carry forward. Yeah, and then later, and I think it was somewhere in the mid-2010, 12-ish, the ranger team created a volunteer opportunity for high schoolers called the Left Hand Outdoor Challenge. And that brought in not only a different kind of energy, but really, as you talk about young people thinking about nature differently and such, I think they definitely created some people who, in their studies, whether it was going to college or getting work after high school, that they wanted to do something in natural resources or historic preservation, too. So it depended on the work that they had been doing.

But Left Hand Outdoor Challenge really struck a chord. We always were doing nature hikes and programming for young children and adults. And it was that middle age that we just hadn't had to do, and the rangers did it. So we know there are always challenges when you are organizing or running volunteer programs.

What are some of the major challenges in sustaining or growing a volunteer program like we have? Probably in the beginning, it was staff understanding how to work with volunteers because they knew how to do it together. But how do you get volunteers involved, and how does that work in the various ages and skills, et cetera? But I think as we grew, we really needed staff buy-in because education and outreach or the one person who really wanted to work with volunteers couldn't do that, that it needed to be stepped up.

And Ron Stewart, who was our director at that time, really saw the benefit of volunteers and really wanted the community to be involved. And he told us as a department, you got to work with volunteers. Almost everybody here can, and I want you to. And then he put his money where his mouth was because volunteers do cost money. They are not free, minus the salary, the staff time, enough staff to really do a quality job, which I think we were doing and still continue to do.

There's equipment, there's recognition, there's resources, and really the biggest resource is staff time. So I think that was the hardest. And many people that they were somebody who really knew how to build a trail or somebody who was a wildlife biologist really good at those skills, not necessarily have experience working with volunteers. So they needed the time too to think about how we're going to work with volunteers. What's the training? What's the equipment? How are we scheduling this? What age is, where are we going to do it? Organizations, be it public or nonprofit, that just think volunteers happen like that, haven't thought of that and haven't seen the results of a bad experience. And I'm sure we had some, but really Ron and Therese, who was a manager at that time, really felt like it was staff's responsibility and that's part of the work plan.

And I think that just was the get go. Had that not happened, it would have been a struggle for many people because they still have a full time job and saying, no, you can take the hours you need to get this ready to do this. And it worked.

So how have the roles of volunteers changed over time? We've talked a little bit about how it was a lot of education and people who just loved nature at first. You know, we've seen shifting in conservation styles and conservation practice, community engagement, community needs. How have we been able to do that adaptation? People volunteer for different reasons.

And some people volunteer because they want to learn. And there's some people that volunteer because they have the expertise. And I think that maybe is what you're asking in some ways, that there are people in our community who really know restoration, working with staff. And I think that's what it was, is that staff would one way or another have a person who says, I can figure this out with you. Whether it was really a formal relationship where, you know, we're partnering or they're just helping or bouncing ideas off or can I suggest this?

I think that volunteers had that leadership ability, but it wasn't necessarily, you know, a title that they wore. But there was more collaboration with members of the community that had that expertise. So it wasn't just their available time. It's like, how can we do this? And, you know, what plants? And there are people in Boulder County, as you know, other parts of the country and their communities are just really experts in certain areas that staff tapped into and worked with them.

So I think the collaboration was at the beginning, it was really scheduling and then they go do it. But behind the scene, I think more over time, collaboration with individuals who either had the interest, but probably more the knowledge of how to do that. Staff took advantage.

Well, and that collaboration leads to like innovation within the department, within the projects, within the what they can because they have the knowledge now. Is there any innovation that really stands out to you? There was a time when we were using a lot of, I believe we still have wildlife cameras. They're called game cameras to many people. But we had them out on open space. Instead of staff or volunteers going out looking for animals, cameras caught them. We had thousands and thousands and thousands of photographs. because they were motion detected. No way did the three biologists have enough time to look at all those photographs to identify what was in them. Somehow it happened, but technology really helped that. They were able to upload this on a particular website and then people volunteered to participate and they would look at 100 photographs and then identify what they saw. And many times they saw nothing. They saw a blue jay or a stellar jay or a deer. Oh, another deer. A deer again. And then there was a bobcat and that really sped it up for the wildlife biologists to take the data and say this is what's going on at Heil. Not even sure who came up with that, but it definitely was a great project and we really did a lot that two or three years that we did that. We sort of cleaned off the cameras and it felt like it was worth doing.

Some people would really want to know, we've talked a little bit about it, the why of our volunteers, why they put in the hours, the study, the sweat equity into our parks and open space. What can you tell me that volunteers have told you or that you know of? Why are these experiences important to them to put all that time in? Definitely, as I mentioned earlier, people want to learn. Like me working or volunteering at the native seed gardens because I want to understand better, you know, just plants in general. How's that cycle spreading those seeds out on open space? What are all the steps? And the experts who have retired or they are currently working as a geologist somewhere just know the value of the Hall 2 property because of the geological features there.

I think another reason is that people want to be outdoors. You know, so many people work indoors exclusively. They just enjoy being outside. It's just fun to be outside. And as open space staff, I sort of forget that, but it's just nice being outside. There's a social part of volunteering and what many, many, many of the ongoing programs where they work in a group or they have to go out in pairs. You know, it's that social being with people with like interest, whether it's wildlife or it's history, that you can bounce off information and books that you've read or have you visited this museum. I think it's also the social interaction of people who will bring their children and go, I want them to not only see open space and understand it, but I want them to give back to open space and hopefully they will want to do that on their own. So I think that social aspect is sort of dual. But we have volunteers who found great friends and they traveled together and developed friendships just because they were, you know, studying history together or turning butter together up at Walker Ranch, leading stargazing programs.

And I think the other, and it's unique to not all programs, but some is that people want to get tired. Again, we are very indoors, sitting down work and to go out on open space and to help thin the forest and drag these branches and make slash piles. And people said over and over, it was really hard, but I loved it. They just felt good and it felt great to be sore the next day and not have to do it again, I'm sure.

The last, and it's constant that I heard, I've just moved to Boulder County. I want to know what there is, or I've lived here forever and I want to give back. So there's a sense of community with the land and with other people who live in Boulder County and just wanting to be together and enjoying open space because it is unique. So many parts of the United States don't have it. People who think about it a little bit or just know that it's like, this is really cool. I think they like that sort of camaraderie and just going, aren't we lucky?

There was one time when we were doing a hike with the volunteer ranger corps and volunteer naturalists. It was one of the new trails opening for Heil. They got a sneak peek ahead of time. There was probably 30 of us and we're hiking and I was in the back because I had the first aid kit and I noticed it just made me laugh is that as we started stringing out on the trail, the volunteer ranger corps were in the front and they were hiking and looking around and loving it. And then the birders were way in the back and they were stopping and constantly stopping. And it was like, you know, each, the subgroups found each other and it was, they're really enjoying the experience of being there and finding an individual or a small group that, you know, wanted to experience it the same way and enjoyed it in sort of, you know, a different way than the smaller other subgroup was doing it. I could havejust divided it. You know, I knew exactly where the line was. It was funny. The exact same space was creating a different experience for each group. Exactly. So let's look to the future a little bit. What do you see as the biggest opportunities for volunteer involvement over the next 50 years? Or maybe just the next 5 or 10? It's a little more biteable, offable chunk.

You know, there's the good news, bad news. I mean, the bad news is climate change. And what we've seen more recently in the past 20 years of just natural disasters. That opportunity is not going to stop. After a flood or a fire, having the community and not individuals but groups come out and help. And for other volunteers to explain what happened. And it will be improved either because of restoration efforts or just time in some cases.

The good news is the department has for a few years now has been really reaching out to all the community. I think the goal is to have a volunteer pool or group that reflects the community. And there's been a lot of effort into doing that. Right now it's been mostly reaching out to the Latinx community. But it's also been geographical. Back in the day, many years, many decades ago, we really worked primarily the volunteers were from Boulder and Longmont. And more and more, Nederland, Louisville, Lafayette, Hygiene, etc. So that to me is the good news because we're a county agency. And county residents have the opportunity to participate in some way or another.

How can, say, someone wanted to get being a volunteer, how would they go about doing that? The easiest way is the web page. That's where the episodic or the one activities are. And then the more ongoing, there's a lot of monitoring programs. I don't think I mentioned. Some are year round. Most of the volunteer opportunities are in the warmer months, which is really seven months, seven to eight months, depending. That's the easiest way. The opposite is if there's a group that wants to help is to the same thing on the website. There's a place where you can say, I have a group that would like to do some outdoor work for you. And contact would be made. That's the easiest way for sure.

You've talked about people with immense expertise. What if someone comes in and they've never done anything like this before? Is all the training provided? Yeah, definitely. You know, you'd asked about what people or volunteers had said to me. It's incredible. You know, some people just feel like I learned so much. So I think those I don't know anything or I just moved here and I don't know this place very well. Training is almost always not almost always. There is always episodic. It might be short. It's 15 minutes. How to use a tool, what we're doing. And then there will be on the job training. Whereas the naturalist program or cultural history at the Agricultural Heritage Center, there's training. And then there is ongoing training, which is something that, you know, I'm very proud that staff did. We talked about it and, you know, we just felt like the volunteer feedback that we got from volunteers was they love the continued education, the continued learning. So we put a lot of effort into offering something at least once a month. And depending on the program, it could be twice a month.

Learning is different. I mean, for some, it really was the classroom learning slide program. Why are there so many more bald eagles in Boulder County to hiking the trail with someone to better understand what are the features? What's special about this? And then there were the occasional behind the scenes where they got off trail to perhaps see the boundary of the property to better understand the wholeness of the work. And that's the one thing about those episodic projects. Most of them really are not on trail because that's done, so to speak. So a lot of that opportunity was off trail and to really get to see open space in a different view, different context. Pretty cool.

What I've found in working with volunteers is that you always get a different story or a different factoid from whomever you are speaking with. And so it's really fun to talk to all the different people and get your knowledge is just expanded by who you're having to be talking to, even though they've had the same training. And it's, you know, the conversations just, it's really amazing because you have people who have never done this, but they know more than they think they do. And that's, I don't know, not human nature, but we were doing a planting and it was just rock hard soil. And it was pretty amazing how theories of how to do it better. You know, it was like, these guys know what they're doing. They don't need us. They got it. So that collective thinking about it, problem solving is great.

If you could tell future volunteers who have just been, they're intrigued and are thinking about it. If you could tell future volunteers one thing or maybe a couple things, what would that be? Well, I would say first jump in, do it. And I do think there's hesitation of I don't know how. And a lot of our volunteers in some programs, not all programs, are people who are retired, maybe getting older and, you know, a little nervous like, I don't know if I can do this. And as with anything, the more you do it, the easier it gets. So I would say you might not feel comfortable leading a tour at the Agriculture Heritage Center. And kindergarteners are first grade, you know, you can do that. And then you move up and the fourth tour that you teach or you lead is better. Just to start that. And it's the physical ability too. I do think sometimes people are scared like thinning trees and carrying a lot. We can do that. I don't think the department has really overextended what people can do, especially working in groups. And that's part of the activity is to not burden any one person or to potential injuries to work as a team.

So just doing it. And really the one thing about volunteer experience is be it here, especially because that's what I know best, is that it ultimately, maybe not one episodic project and, you know, life is different. But for those volunteers that really, you know, do a few or they sign up for a full year or two years and my gosh, it's five years later, it becomes a part of who you are. And I think there's just such a warmth to that, that I am more than just a person who lives on Parr Road or I'm retired, that I have been involved and I can go back to Heil and go, I helped plant some of those trees. And that's really exciting. And it's just really part of that community. And I think part of Mother Earth, you know, to sort of go down that route, that we are all connected and can really be involved.

And I, through my years and I assume, you know, you too, that I've been to a few funerals, volunteers that passed away, these volunteer experiences were really part of who they were. It was heartwarming. As you said, so many of our jobs are sitting down and doing emails and that type of thing. It's nice to be able to see something that's tangible. You know, this hillside has been cleared because of things that I did or this group of kindergartners now knows what a cow does on the farm. You know, it really is a tangible result, which we don't often get in our world these days.

And in some ways, because it's volunteer, it was my choice. Whereas, you know, some people work, it's like, boss told me to do this. It's something that they want to do. Sometimes they're led by their spouse, but it's, I don't know, I think it's even a little bit more rewarding. And then occasionally you will see that eagle fly overhead or somebody, you know, saw some rare plant. And that's just, you know, over the moon kind of thing.

Well, I really thank you for joining us today, Pascal. It was wonderful talking with you. I appreciate the invitation. I really do. Thank you for listening to this episode. We'd like to thank Longmont Public Media for use of their studio space for our recording. Please remember to like and follow us on social media, Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube, and subscribe to our podcast series on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you.